Hey y'all! I'm still in NYC - and I love this city! Beautiful place, beautiful people and the vibe is unique!
There is this question stuck in my head and it has in some ways got clearer while being here. I might be wrong, but I gotta drop my thought.
In some ways I think, this is a thought that might be wrong, that most of the black women that like white men, are looking for white guys that are living the "white life". I mean like typical, from the media focused, "white life". I can't really describe it, and probably there is no such thing, but you know what I mean - more in a metaphors way.
Is this thought of mine in any way true? I'm curious to see your answers!
In my hand, I sometime feel like I've got into a "grey zone" - I sometimes get the impression my way of "adepting to the black culture" is seeing as something negative (negative is not really the right word, but...). But I gotta make this clear - im not adepting anything, I'm just being myself. I happen to love a lot of the "black music", i'm probably using a lot of words that some people would relate to the "black culture", I'm probably wearing a special type of clothes, etc etc. But I'm just being me.
But I'm curious to get some feedback, critique, and reflection on my thought! :)
24 comments:
Well, I haven't been to New York in a while. But I will say that I, as a woman who passes for black, do not like the urban hip hop culture at all. I simply think it is derogatory for all women, especially black women. So if I see a white guy or any non-black guy for that matter, that gives off the vibes of being a fan of that culture, my attraction to him will decrease, even if he is a great person. He just won't be the one for me. I don't think I find anti-black woman sentiments among white men who are not fans of hip hop culture. Perhaps this is why I would be more inclined to feel safe and attracted to them. One thing I feel needs to be clarified is that there is no "one black culture." The urban hip hop stuff is not a part of "black culture." There might be an abundance of black faces used to represent that culture, giving you the perception that it must be a "black" thing, but truth be told, Hip Hop culture is largely an American culture thing. And it usually does not have a positive influence.
Whenever you start out a conversation by saying "most black women" want or like this or that, you're already setting yourself up for disappointment-because each woman's wants and desires are different.
Are you saying that you're too "urban" or too "hip-hop" for African-American women?
If that's the case, it's not a matter of black women not being attracted to you or a certain type of white guy. It's a matter of not being in the right place at the right time :-D
However, due to stereotypes, many believe that ALL of us are into hip-hop music/scene but we're not.
I hope I didn't misunderstand you...
Interesting answers there! Gonna get back to them more soon! And you all know this blog is called "thoughts of a white b'woy" so I gotta drop thing I'm thinking of :) and I'm here to learn more and more about the life. If you don't ask the question... And I hope this is not too political incorrect... :)
Black/white are colors, not the way someone lives. There is no such thing as "the white life". Stop assuming all Black woman fall into some convenient stereotype. Embracing certain types of music and modes of behavior doesn't change the fact that you are white. You will always live the white life, because you were born a white person. Conversely, a Black woman who listens to rock, dislikes hiphop, and isn't into "thugs" isn't rejecting her blackness. If you sincerely love Black women as much as you claim than you need to realize (and very quickly I might add) that race is a incredibly complex concept (and that's all race is really; a concept without any solid biological science behind it) and relying on stereotypes to navigate the so-called "others" world (and by other I am pertaining to Black women) is a sign that you still haven't come to terms with your white privilege, and as a Black woman myself, I know I personally would not take you seriously.
There is nothing wrong with being white and being into hiphop and having a preference for women of color, if that sincerely is who you are you can't change that, but just as you identify yourself as an individual, you need to realize Black women are individuals too.
Why is your world so fixated in black or white? It's about chemistry, if you walk around thinking you are a white guy looking for a black woman u send out vibes that is not attractive at all. See people for their unique characters instead of this ideal you created.. It seems to me you need to mature and stop this exoticism, there is more to life than the eye can see.
Love the new layout!
First and foremost I think "white life" has to be defined. Are you talking about what you see in movies and on TV? Are you talking about white privilege- that was the first thing that came to my mind. Just like there is more than one definition of "black culture" there can be more than one definition of "white life" or "white American culture." I also think cultural differences may account for what you're experiencing as well.
I think as a WM you're already living the "white life" as you already have white-male-privilege. Evia's discussed this to some degree on her blog. So whether you're a blue collar WM or a WM Senator you already have privilege's that males of other ethnicities don't have.
I will also acknowledge that there are some BW out there who feel that in order to be with a WM he must wealthy, a Brad Pitt look alike, etc., otherwise what's the point. That's not a good way to look at IR relationships but some women do think that way.
I think certain sectors of "hip hop culture" are evolving in a sense where black people can be proud of the image it projects of us. But we're still a long way to go in terms of how we portray the value of women. Personally, I find myself more attracted to white men than black men. I have a pretty eclectic style and prefer the man to have a certain appreciation of "black culture", but not overly so. I feel pretty assimilated in "white culture" so I guess I'm looking for the yin to my yang.
Andreas,
I think it's great that you love BW and that you ask honest questions to learn more about us.
Because BW in America have historically been treated in a racist, degrading, disrespectful way, most BW want WM (men of ANY race) to interact with them in a respectful, honoring way.
Most hip-hop and/or thug rap culture culture is responsible for promoting ANTI-BW RACISM/DISRESPECT worldwide and that is why many BW don't like it and don't trust men (of ANY race) who are into it.
I think those of us who know you/your excellent blog understand that you like/respect BW even though you like hip-hop. If you start a relationship with a BW (especially in America), you may need to let her know that, although you like hip-hop, you don't support the disrespect/degradation of BW.
I think black women like both,if you are a guy who is respectful and respect our culture its a plus and yes hip hop is part of our culture;all hip hop is not bad its a small part of who we are but not all of us,black women like men no matter what color to respect them and,love them,if this is who you are and you are ginuwine about it, we will understand but learn all about our culture externally and interiorily,their is no one way to be black its a diverse culture, that is connected by family history,struggle and our experiences we share because of the way we are treated and seen by society,so we express ourselves in different or similar ways,be patient it will happen but keep in mind appreciating our culture is really nice but also chemistry, attraction and common interest is also a factor, maybe the women are shy or don't quite know what to think of you in the states there is a big race problem,so a cute white guy approaching us is different,don't get frustrated its going to take time but try to see us as individuals there are things we all like differently in guys so understand that,hopefully soon you will find that chocolate girl of your dreams soon good luck.
Hmmm... as an afro Puerto Rican that grew up in suburbia, its mixed. Some women want the stereotype, others just want someone genuine. It depends if the women are going for status or genuine love and attraction.
I personally don't like rap (I like rock and new age music), but if you like it that's fine. We all have different interests and that what makes all of us beautiful. :-)
Your thoughts on the matter are fairly valid. The black women I know, if they so choose to date outside their race its an implicit escape from what they are accustomed to and a welcoming of something 'different'. The schemas we have prototyped in our brains are very interesting regarding interracial dating.
For the white blockes who do enjoy black music and other black 'stuff' are normally misjudged as trying to be black in order to gain some sort of acceptance in to the black community.I see and grasp where you are coming from, I see it happen everyday. Very interesting!
I don't think it's that black women are looking for men living the "white life" rather, I think like most people, we want to date people who are true to themselves and authentic. I think the resistant you may have experienced is that the women you've met may assume you are a "poser" and trying to be "black"...whatever that means. Just be yourself as you already are, and I'm sure that once people get to know you, they'll realize you're just expressing what you feel on the inside. good luck!
Hay, Are your thoughts in relation to my comments posted a while back.
I adore women of colour, and am happily married to a Zambian women. I enjoy hip hop, dance hall, kwito, rhumba. However I don't like hip hop culture because it has limited appreciation of black beauty.
I enjoy your site because you show women with a variety of skin shades. As I said before watch a hip hop clip, usually the only women shown are lighter or mixed types.
And when it comes to sterotyping "black culture" I couldn't agree more with the posts above me. Black women are human beings first and foremost; as such, they have a variety of tastes in food, clothing, music, movies etc.
While I enjoy African music like soukous and kwito, more then my African wife (I am white), I can't tell you how happy she gets when I bring her a Michael Buble or Josh Groban DVD as a gift (I am not a fan of this music).
If upon meeting my wife, if I assumed she liked hip hop or liked certain "black/african" things, rather then getting to know her as a person, that is, finding out what she actually liked, I doubt she would of given me the time of day.
I am comfortable in my blackness as I define it, I am attracted to white men who are comfortable in their whiteness as they define it. I am not at all attracted to white men who choose to emulate or imitate blackness; that is unnecessary and insulting. However, I am aware and comfortable with people who are global, who have an appreciation and respect for other cultures. There is a vast difference between appreciating and respecting blackness and thinking you are black when you are not. One is genuine and one in incredibly phony. Hope that helps.
Personally, as a BW, I have dated "Urban" WM or, the term that I really hate, but I will use it to illustrate this, WM who "act" Black and I felt more comfortable because I didn't have to explain as much to them about certain things that are unique to Black culture or my Caribbean culture. I'm not talking about a WM who goes around acting like Vanilla Ice, but someone who actually has a true appreciation for Black people and everything that they have contributed to society. A guy who possibly grew up around Black people or at least, has Black friends. Not just some Suburban White guy who watches too many rap videos and acts the stereotype of what a Black person is because not all Black people are alike just like not all White people are alike. I have family in NY and I have been there several times. It is supposed to be a melting pot of different cultures and that is what is supposed to be so cool about it. More than anything, it is attractive for a guy to just be himself and pretend to be anything else. The few Swedish guys I have met seemed very shy and not very outgoing, but I'm sure that not all of them are that way ;-)
I agree with Selena that it differs for each woman. I enjoy all types of music, including hip-hop. However, I usually don't go after men who are immersed in hip hop culture be they black, white, or any other ethnicity. At the same time,even though I am extremely attracted to white men, what I think you're trying to describe as "the white life" isn't that attractive to me either. To be honest, it's just a game of being yourself, and finding a specific "someone" who fits you, rather than a specific "some people." I hope that makes sense :)
I've finally added you to my favourites as you're deleting insensitive and insulting comments.
I was looking for Naomie Harris on google and came across your blog...again!.
To make it short and as I'm late to this discussion,I'm echoing Damian and the anonymous @ 8.37am opinions/comments.
I think your question has validity and in all honesty I have heard the question before. The truth is the world is a wonderful place with all kinds of people and as such I love the fact that you have embraced aspects of a culture that is not your own; how else would you learn about others if not to embrace that which you view to be their attributes. That said it is my belief that there are women of every color who choose men based upon what they can "get" and not for love. I find that to be a sad reality of our time but rest assured the large majority of women follow their hearts no matter where it may lead them. I applaud you for having the courage to ask the question after-all it is better to know than to assume.
I know what you mean and I do think that there are some black women that would go for that. My thing is if you're a person I can relate to and we can have meaningful conversations and you have ambition, dress nice and just an all around approachable dude than I'm interested. I don't like putting guys into categories. I think everyone is different and there is only one of you so if I like who YOU are then that's all I need to know. But I understand what you mean.
I am a AA woman who lived in NY and found that there are also a large number of BW of West Indian and African descent. I, too, prefer someone who know who they are, has no difficulties with enjoying others' cultures, and will treat me with love and respect as I will treat him. Each woman is different. I found that NYC and its Burroughs are more of an amalgam of peoples than solely one culture or another. There are other parts of NY and 49 other states for you to visit. We looking forward to confounding you further, as in some instances, nothing here is as it seems.
Jag bara antar att man får skriva på svenska :) Det blev lite hetsigt här, men jag förstår precis vad du menar! Dock tror jag att det beror mer på kultur, alltså om man är en "europeisk" svart tjej, som jag själv eller om man är från ex USA eller den afrikanska kontinenten. Jag känner dock motsatsen, att killar som generellt tänder mer på svarta tjejer är väldigt mycket ute efter stereotypen och blir alltid väldigt besvikna när de inser att jag är väldigt försvenskad... Precis som du verkar lite mer black än svenne så är jag motsatsen, alltså inte det omvärlden har stereotypiserat och väntar sig av oss, både i könsroller och i etnicitet. Vet inte vad mer jag ska säga... Vill inte skälla på dig, din tanke har ju en verklighetsbaserad grund även om generaliseringar aldrig är bra :) Ha det bra i nyc!
What is important is you do not see "black people" as a nuisance but you are willing to learn about different cultures(I say cultures because there is no one culture for "black people" that is why stereotypes are not good). At the end of the day the only thing that makes you sorter different from me is culture.
I am enjoying this experiemental blog so far. You should google, the "White guy" that graduated top of his class at the all black college (More house College) It was on CNN.
This is interesting to me. Though i'm sure what you wrote could be picked apart for political incorrectness, i can see past that, to the point you are expressing and asking about.
My comment on the topic is simply that the only difference between a stereotypical "white" or "black" life is the difference in culture between the two stereotypes (white and black people themselves are not that different. It's the society that they're in and culture that they're used to that makes them different). Whatever major group someone has immersed themselves into will help shape (but not define) who they are and what they are interested in.
Many people are fascinated by people and things that are much unlike what they are used to, which is why many people become friends or in many cases lovers of races that are not their own.
So what i'm trying to say concisely (even though your question is loaded) is that yes, I believe that many black women who are interested in white men (or any other race or culture for that matter) will also in some way be interested in experiencing and immersing themselves in something that is new or unlike what they are used to. I believe it is more about learning about something they are interested in than wanting to be with them just because they are white or living in a certain way.
BUT it should also be noted that we are obviously all human... and it is just as possible for people of all races to live lives that are similar to those of other races. This is because race does not define culture, it is only a small factor. So it could also be said that some black women could gravitate toward people who live a (stereotypical) "white" life, because this is the type of life/culture that they are used to, and they see many things that they have in common.
Here in the Caribbean, one of the greatest aspects of our culture is the fact that we have so many different races and mixes. I think it's beautiful. Because of my culture, i'm open to dating people of any race, as long as i like the person that they are inside.
I'm sorry I wrote so much... I just think about this a lot.
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